27. How To Improve Nutrition and Muscle Mass with Lauren Embree

[00:00:00] Honestly, focus on building your muscle mass and keeping that on with, you know, eating enough protein, moving your body, lifting some weights a couple days a week.

[00:00:08] Like, you don't have to do anything crazy drastic, but when you focus on maintaining muscle mass, you will lose body fat because now you're not going to burn right through your muscle by not eating enough.

[00:00:27] Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Better Medicine Podcast. I'm Dr. Omar Akhter. Today, I'm very excited to be joined with Lauren Embree.

[00:00:34] Lauren is a functional medicine nutritionist and founder of Embree Wellness. She's a graduate of the Academy of Functional Medicine and has a BS in sports management.

[00:00:44] She was also a two-time national tennis champion and a five-time All-American in her college career before turning professional with a career on the WTA Tour.

[00:00:53] So, Lauren, thanks so much for joining me. I really appreciate your time today.

[00:00:56] Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to talk nutrition and health and be helping people.

[00:01:02] Yeah. So, this is kind of a big discussion for me because this podcast, Better Medicine, has been something that I've done for maybe 25 or 26 episodes.

[00:01:12] And I've taken a little hiatus for around seven or eight months. And this is my first episode back.

[00:01:19] So, I'm really excited about this. And, you know, it's me going to the next level.

[00:01:25] So, what better way to do it than to talk about something so foundational like nutrition?

[00:01:31] Totally. Yeah.

[00:01:32] So, yeah, that's what we're going to be talking about today.

[00:01:34] Awesome.

[00:01:35] So, you've had a really great tennis career and obviously you're a very fit athlete, but you had your own health struggles.

[00:01:43] So, I'd like to know a little bit about your own health struggles and your journey from being a professional athlete to where you are today as a functional nutritionist.

[00:01:53] Yeah. It's been a wild ride, honestly. Like you said, I played competitive tennis my entire life.

[00:01:58] And being an athlete and being so reliant on my body, I didn't really correlate the two at all.

[00:02:04] Had a great collegiate career. We won many national championships, pivoted and then turned pro and had a great tennis career on the tour and then got into college coaching.

[00:02:14] But through that whole journey, I got pretty sick with my own autoimmune diseases and being, you know, 18 to 22 thinking you're pretty invincible because you're an athlete and you're in good shape and you're healthy.

[00:02:24] I actually was so unhealthy on the inside out or on the inside. So, went to a lot of doctors and nobody could really kind of figure out or pinpoint exactly what was wrong.

[00:02:35] So, when I was 21, 22 graduating from Florida, I got pivoted to a functional medicine doctor in Beverly Hills and he completely opened up my world to holistic health and functional medicine.

[00:02:46] Did a lot of lab and blood testing, which I know you do at your practice and stuff and really got to the root cause of what was causing a lot of my pain and sickness.

[00:02:54] I mean, I could not get out of bed in the morning. My back was so bad. I had crazy flare-ups in my eye, which obviously playing at a high level, the ball, like my depth perception was a little off.

[00:03:03] So, it was, I really struggled. So, he changed my diet completely. He got me going, you know, gluten-free, dairy-free, egg-free, soy-free, all of the things.

[00:03:13] And it basically just calmed down so much of my inflammation that I was diagnosed with incleosing spondylitis.

[00:03:19] I was diagnosed with uveitis. I was diagnosed with IBS. Like, all of these things, I had zero clue what they were.

[00:03:24] So, when I was 22, I had a choice of like, okay, I can really buy into his program or just continue to be really sick.

[00:03:30] And I wanted, obviously, a great professional career. So, chose that. It was really difficult because I was traveling the world.

[00:03:36] So, telling a 22-year-old you can't eat basically everything I was eating was a challenge. But I did it.

[00:03:42] And within six months, I went from like the worst pain ever to barely any.

[00:03:47] And fast forward 10, 11 years later, I just went down a complete rabbit hole with functional medicine and nutrition because I wanted to give back to people who aren't feeling great.

[00:03:58] And I just really quickly understood the power of nutrition and how correlated it is to how you feel.

[00:04:03] So, really just redid school and just found a way to get out of, once I retired from my tennis career and got out of college coaching, I had this nutrition background.

[00:04:13] And now I'm fully engulfed in embryo wellness and, you know, meeting cool people like you and partnering with amazing like doctors and, you know, academies and things like that.

[00:04:22] I can just like help people really feel a whole lot better.

[00:04:26] Yeah, quite an amazing journey.

[00:04:28] So, we're talking about nutrition in this discussion.

[00:04:32] It's such a wide topic, right?

[00:04:34] And so, we're trying to give some general principles because it's very difficult to encapsulate all of nutrition in an hour or even 10 hours.

[00:04:42] But as I was thinking about it today, you know, my own journey in the world of medicine when I was going through medical school and residency training, which is a total of eight years, I was just thinking and looking back and realized that I couldn't really think of a time where I was properly taught any amount of nutrition at all.

[00:05:02] And that's really terrible to think that over an eight-year period, you can't come up with one time that you had a dedicated class to nutrition or something like that.

[00:05:13] And so, my own journey has been the same where it's been this journey of kind of self-discovery through seeing what my patients go through, through seeing what is needed out there in the world of chronic disease.

[00:05:25] And so, that's what we're going to try to tackle today.

[00:05:27] And so, I wanted to dig into some pain points around nutritional research because I think that the first thing that people have to understand is that the reason there is so much misinformation around nutrition is because there's so much disagreement about what is correct nutrition, what isn't.

[00:05:46] And that comes from a lack of excellent research out there because it's very difficult to do nutritional research, as you know.

[00:05:53] Totally.

[00:05:54] So, to do an ideal study, you would have to give two sets of people basically very similar controlled variables, which is impossible in the real world.

[00:06:05] Give them two different diets, have them stick to it, and then follow them over a period of 20 or 30 years to see outcomes.

[00:06:12] And you can do that with pharmaceutical medications, but it's very difficult to do from a nutritional perspective.

[00:06:18] So, that's what people don't have to understand that when you're trying to figure out the best nutrition principles, you have to take a collective approach, which is like it's all together.

[00:06:30] And you just take the research together rather than, oh, this one study said this.

[00:06:34] Because you can find the studies that say that.

[00:06:36] Of course.

[00:06:36] You know, if the dairy industry sponsors a study, it's going to say that milk is good for you.

[00:06:41] Of course, right.

[00:06:41] So, that's how nutritional research works.

[00:06:44] And so, first, I'm curious about your thoughts on this topic of nutritional research.

[00:06:49] Yeah.

[00:06:49] And then we can dive into some of the more important principles.

[00:06:52] Yeah.

[00:06:52] And exactly like you said, like I do think where I find nutrition so fascinating is it's definitely not a one-size-fits-all approach.

[00:06:59] Right.

[00:06:59] Because it's really hard to find the data and the research that's backing like the masses of people.

[00:07:04] But I think there is science to a certain point that says, okay, the power of protein, and this is why it's important because muscle is one of our biggest organs.

[00:07:13] We need to protect it.

[00:07:14] But so, like, as long as we're following guidelines that are data-driven and, like, this is science and this is actually true as opposed to, like, seeing something on TikTok and being like, oh, this worked for her.

[00:07:26] I'm going to try this.

[00:07:26] Like, that's where it gets super confusing in my opinion and just trying to keep things so simple.

[00:07:32] But the biggest thing is it's not a one-size-fits-all approach and what works for me might not work for you.

[00:07:38] But, like, dairy is an inflammatory.

[00:07:42] Probably.

[00:07:42] You know, like processed dairy.

[00:07:44] Gluten, is it inflammatory?

[00:07:45] Yes.

[00:07:46] Like, there's certain principles that you can kind of abide by and then wean off of certain things when it comes to nutrition that will help.

[00:07:53] Not saying it's, like, the end-all be-all because everybody reacts differently.

[00:07:56] And that also is very dependent on, like, gut health.

[00:07:58] And that can be, like, a whole other podcast on just, like, gut health.

[00:08:01] But, you know, trying to usually a healthy gut is a healthy body.

[00:08:05] So, like, trying to, like, determine that first and really focus on that, I think, where nutrition can be really powerful and you can actually, like, push the needle forward.

[00:08:13] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:08:43] Absolutely.

[00:08:44] And so, like, what we're talking about today was around saturated fats, right?

[00:09:14] The Heart Association recommends getting less than 5% of your calories from saturated fats, or at least they used to.

[00:09:20] Yeah.

[00:09:21] And what's funny about that is that breast milk actually contains 25% of it from saturated fats.

[00:09:27] So, you'd have to ban breast milk.

[00:09:28] Right.

[00:09:30] So, I say that to say that a lot of these guidelines we have gotten wrong previously.

[00:09:35] And so, I think that's what frustrates people is that, you know, what diet do I follow?

[00:09:41] Paleo, vegan, you know, because there's so much dogma around nutrition.

[00:09:47] Whereas, I think at a base level, we just need to be giving people first good nutritional principles.

[00:09:52] So, maybe we can dive into that and then also just maybe tell people what are kind of your overarching principles of nutrition that you'd recommend if you were talking to someone on the street.

[00:10:03] Let's say you don't know exactly their particular circumstance.

[00:10:06] Totally.

[00:10:07] But that would be great to touch on.

[00:10:08] Yeah. So, and again, like it's knowing the person's lifestyle and, you know, way that they work because I think just a number one, you know, baseline to start, even someone on the street, like that you're walking by on the street that you don't know at all, is like, okay, how much protein are you getting every single day?

[00:10:25] And like, if you just start with trying to shift the first meal that you eat every single day with something nourishing, something whole, like eating a whole food or a one ingredient food, like you'd be surprised how many people don't know that.

[00:10:39] I certainly didn't or I didn't think about it when I was 18.

[00:10:42] It's like, what's a one ingredient food?

[00:10:44] I'm like, what?

[00:10:45] But now it makes sense.

[00:10:45] Broccoli, sweet potato, chicken, like eggs, like trying to stay towards that principle is so simple.

[00:10:51] And it's something people can be like, oh, I can do that.

[00:10:53] I can focus on getting for females about 30, for males about 40 grams of protein minimum in the first meal that I eat.

[00:11:00] Don't even care what time it is.

[00:11:02] Just like that first meal you break your fast with because that's breakfast, right?

[00:11:05] Breaking your fast, like trying to consume something nourishing that's not going to like not going to send our blood sugar on this roller coaster of a ride where a lot of us are probably consuming things that are like a bagel or a simple sugar or nothing at all or, you know, undernourishing.

[00:11:21] So that's probably the biggest one, I think, is like that whole food, one ingredient, just trying to start your-

[00:11:27] Unprocessed.

[00:11:28] Unprocessed.

[00:11:29] Yeah, like however you want to say it, it all falls under the same category.

[00:11:32] Minimally processed.

[00:11:33] But trying to really hit this 30 to 40 grams of protein threshold in that first meal.

[00:11:38] And then I like to tell like people if your day falls apart after that, fine.

[00:11:41] But at least you got like one solid meal and people can do that.

[00:11:45] Whereas like the whole diet craze of like, I'm going to go on a diet.

[00:11:49] Well, now you're going to be starving.

[00:11:50] Hunger is going to win every time.

[00:11:52] Like it's not going to be sustainable.

[00:11:53] So we need to find something that's the most sustainable approach.

[00:11:57] And it's just like that whole balance of trying to get enough protein because I feel like most of us are pretty undernourished in that department.

[00:12:04] So let me ask you about that.

[00:12:06] Do you have a set like per kilogram amount of protein that you would recommend?

[00:12:11] Because I know the dietary recommendations of maybe 0.8 per kilogram is way too low.

[00:12:17] Yeah, and that's where I think it's way too low.

[00:12:19] And people have different opinions on that.

[00:12:20] But I do think a safe space is if you can get a gram per pound of your ideal body weight.

[00:12:26] So if I feel good, I'll use myself.

[00:12:29] I feel good at, you know, 145 to 148 pounds.

[00:12:33] That's how many grams of protein I should be consuming every day.

[00:12:36] If I have a client that's 280 and he or she is trying to be 210, okay, we need to work our way up to that 210 mark.

[00:12:43] But you're not going to get there tomorrow if your body is used to 50 grams of protein a day.

[00:12:48] So I like to say just try and get 75, then try and get 90, then try and get 110.

[00:12:53] And you'll be shocked about how full you are because as we know, protein satiates us the most and keeps us the most full.

[00:12:59] So it can be done, but not if we're overconsuming other things before that.

[00:13:04] Yeah.

[00:13:05] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:13:06] And so I want to dig into a little bit of continuing on in the principles.

[00:13:13] So I think talking about minimally processed, talking about trying to get away from those chemicals, a lot of the chemicals that we have.

[00:13:21] So ideally organic foods, these types of things.

[00:13:25] And then we can talk a little bit outside of protein.

[00:13:29] Do you have a sense of the other macros and a little bit of overall guidance for people on that?

[00:13:36] Yeah.

[00:13:37] So piggyback off the protein, if we're like, okay, I can do that, the carbohydrate debacle, right?

[00:13:42] Right.

[00:13:43] Like carbs aren't necessarily bad.

[00:13:44] It's just I think we're overconsuming the wrong kinds of them.

[00:13:47] But definitely keep, they're for our brain, they're for energy.

[00:13:50] They give us, you know, this glucose spike when we work out and when we're doing all the things that we need to do during the day.

[00:13:56] But a good rule of thumb for the carbohydrate load, I would say, is just try and keep it one-to-one with the protein.

[00:14:01] So if I'm having 150 grams of protein a day, okay, my carbs, if I'm not crazy active, is probably not consuming more than that.

[00:14:09] And that's a good baseline, again, for people because 150 grams of carbs for me seems like a lot.

[00:14:15] But for some people, they're consuming 300 without even realizing it.

[00:14:19] And to pair it with your proteins is also important.

[00:14:21] Yeah.

[00:14:21] And try not to have it by itself, right?

[00:14:23] Because the blood sugar, like I just had a CGM on me for 10 days just as an experiment because I wanted to use it for my clients.

[00:14:30] But I wanted to do it first.

[00:14:32] And it's fascinating to understand what certain foods do for me to spike my blood sugar.

[00:14:37] And if I ate some grapes, if I had too many grapes alone, like my CGM was going off that it was like pretty high.

[00:14:44] But if I had, you know, some protein and then some grapes, it was like a little bit more steady.

[00:14:48] So, yeah, always trying to like dress your carbs, don't leave them naked is kind of like the saying and pair it with stuff.

[00:14:55] Yeah, pairing it with stuff and eating it after is also something that helps with blood sugar.

[00:15:00] Totally.

[00:15:01] Yeah.

[00:15:01] And blood sugar and, you know, insulin and fasting glucose and all these are super important to the whole diabetes and the whole inflammatory response that's just like continuing to make us pretty sick.

[00:15:12] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:15:13] I want to touch a little bit on weight loss because when you talk about nutrition, I think there's a lot of people that are going to be eating not just for nutrition purpose itself, but to lose weight.

[00:15:25] Mm-hmm.

[00:15:26] I think I've definitely found it to be one of the pain points in my practice of seeing patients where it's never a linear, you know, a straight line going there.

[00:15:36] So, you know, for people to know that there's so many components to weight.

[00:15:42] So you want to make sure hormones are looked at and optimized if that's the case because, you know, if insulin levels are very high and you have insulin resistance, if you have thyroid problems, if you have other hormonal issues relating to perimenopause, menopause, then that is already a barrier to weight loss.

[00:16:28] Mm-hmm.

[00:16:29] But maintaining their muscle mass.

[00:16:31] And again, like if we just lose weight and are in too much of a caloric deficit for too long, well, now we're starting to burn right through our muscle.

[00:16:39] So they're not having, they're not seeing kind of the results that they want long term that's sustainable.

[00:16:45] So something that's helpful, I think, for people is honestly focus on building your muscle mass and keeping that on with, you know, eating enough protein, moving your body, lifting some weights a couple days a week.

[00:16:55] Like you don't have to do anything crazy drastic.

[00:16:58] But when you focus on maintaining muscle mass, you will lose body fat because now you're not going to burn right through your muscle by not eating enough.

[00:17:06] And I think a lot of women in particular do so hyper-focused on eating too much when I think they're actually not eating enough of the right kind of foods.

[00:17:15] Of the right kind of foods.

[00:17:16] Of the right kind of foods.

[00:17:17] That's the most important thing.

[00:17:17] Yeah.

[00:17:18] Like counting calories as opposed to counting macros I think can backfire a little bit because not all calories are equal.

[00:17:25] So if you have somebody on a 1500 calorie diet and they're a pretty big person, that's too low.

[00:17:31] So now their metabolism, their adrenals, everything's off.

[00:17:35] So I think if you focus on building muscle by upping your protein, you actually won't have space or room for these processed foods that we talk about that are also super hyper palatable and addicting.

[00:17:46] So the less you eat of them, the less you will crave.

[00:17:50] And then things start to make more sense for people.

[00:17:52] And they don't have to feel like they're on a diet because, you know, the best diet is the one that's the most sustainable.

[00:17:59] And that's really just eating whole or trying to focus on eating like nutrient-dense whole foods and not affiliating with like this food's bad, this food's good.

[00:18:07] There's not one food that's really bad, I would say.

[00:18:10] Maybe like sugar.

[00:18:11] A lot of sugar can be pretty bad.

[00:18:13] Refined sugar.

[00:18:13] Yeah, but, you know, there's not one food that's bad.

[00:18:17] It's just like there's better foods than others that we can be eating more of.

[00:18:20] Right.

[00:18:20] So if a patient comes to you with a primary goal of weight loss, building protein as a – or building muscle mass through protein as a first step.

[00:18:29] Yes, is a first step.

[00:18:31] And depending on – you know, I'll do a food log or food journal with them and seeing kind of their habits and their timing.

[00:18:37] Like timing's pretty important too.

[00:18:38] And that's what they do.

[00:18:39] For females and women in particular, they're probably not eating until 11 or 12 because they're not hungry because their hormones are a little unbalanced.

[00:18:46] So actually giving them like a meal that's going to help with their cortisol, hormones, you know, all of that earlier in the day.

[00:18:52] And now they're set up for a better day as opposed to skipping all that and it's just, you know, eating a bunch at night and not going to sleep.

[00:18:59] And it's a whole like vicious cycle.

[00:19:01] Right.

[00:19:02] And once you do get the protein intake figured out, between carbs and fats, at least from what I have seen and read, it does seem that a lower – generally speaking, a lower carbohydrate diet, higher fat is going to help you burn more body fat.

[00:19:18] And that's at least from the studies that I've seen.

[00:19:21] Yes.

[00:19:22] Right.

[00:19:22] Because it's going to metabolize that a bit faster.

[00:19:24] Yes.

[00:19:25] So, yeah, just curious on your thoughts.

[00:19:26] Yeah.

[00:19:27] I'm actually definitely aligned with that too.

[00:19:29] I do think that they both can't be high.

[00:19:32] Right.

[00:19:32] Like your carbohydrate and your fat both can't be high.

[00:19:34] One's got to give.

[00:19:35] So the carbohydrate load being a little bit lower I think is optimal for most.

[00:19:40] I wouldn't say that's for everybody.

[00:19:41] I will say there's an exception probably for like the high-performing athlete or, you know, the female that works out a bunch or has a high-stress job on top of exercise.

[00:19:51] Like they might actually operate on higher carb, lower fat just because they need more carbs to supply them with everything they're doing.

[00:19:58] But I'm definitely in that space of lower carb just in general.

[00:20:03] You can probably do like less than 100 grams of carbs a day if you're not that active.

[00:20:09] You know, and fat trying to keep somewhat balanced.

[00:20:13] Fat, there's nine grams, you know, per calorie, so it can be pretty caloric.

[00:20:16] So just watching that, but we need fat to burn fat and that was to your point earlier, like not being scared of fat, but just being mindful of how much we're getting every single day because it can add up from a caloric input number.

[00:20:29] Right.

[00:20:30] Yeah.

[00:20:30] And we were going to talk about an athlete and what their unique needs are.

[00:20:35] And you have a unique situation because you've been a professional athlete.

[00:20:38] So I'm interested in how would you see a professional athlete that comes to you differently than the typical person?

[00:20:45] Totally.

[00:20:45] And it's treated very differently.

[00:20:47] I still work with athletes in high school and professional, and it's just kind of mind blowing because I was once them.

[00:20:54] So I feel like I can kind of speak on it about how misinformed we are about like the whole space.

[00:21:01] If you need carbs, you need to be eating all the time.

[00:21:03] Like you need this pasta meal before your match the next day.

[00:21:06] And it's like, hold on a second.

[00:21:07] Like, let's just see, ask the person or the athlete, like, how are they feeling?

[00:21:11] Most of the time they're super tired.

[00:21:14] I will say, and I'm pretty convinced the reason I got so sick was I was very overtrained.

[00:21:20] Tennis is a very overtrained sport.

[00:21:21] I was very stressed out.

[00:21:23] I was in a crazy toxic environment.

[00:21:25] So like I was dealing with change going from college to pro.

[00:21:28] So there's like traveling the world.

[00:21:29] So there's so many variables that like basically make my immune system just like go on fire.

[00:21:34] And most athletes are dealing with more than one thing of stress.

[00:21:38] So it's definitely treated differently.

[00:21:40] But they're just, again, they're eating the wrong types of foods that's making them really tired or injured.

[00:21:45] And as soon as we clean that up, meal timing is a huge one with them as well.

[00:21:50] Like what are they eating after their match or game?

[00:21:53] How many hours before are they eating?

[00:21:55] There's strategies in place.

[00:21:56] And once we can hit that and do that a little bit better, it's like amazing how much progress they have on court without feeling like they're going to, you know, just fall over by like the third set or, you know, the end of the game or whatever it is.

[00:22:08] The last 10 seconds of the race, like whatever it is.

[00:22:11] It just helps so much like tackling the nutrition piece.

[00:22:14] Yeah, there's a I think there's a prototype of the female that over trains and then they have imbalances up to their female hormones as well.

[00:22:23] You know, cycle irregularity and no cycles.

[00:22:26] Totally.

[00:22:27] You know, and not talked about enough.

[00:22:29] Like, I mean, most female athletes, I feel like when I was at Florida, a lot of us like weren't getting regular periods, like super undernourished, hurt all the time.

[00:22:39] You know, tendonitis somewhere.

[00:22:41] And then, yes, we're getting cortisone shots and we're taking Advil.

[00:22:43] And where it's like there's a time and place for all of that, of course, because we need to perform and we need to be on court.

[00:22:48] We want to.

[00:22:49] But again, like by doing that now, that's compromising my gut health.

[00:22:52] So like probiotic didn't even know what that was at 18.

[00:22:55] Like, you know, so just there's things that you can do to help maintain your gut health when you are like inflamed or injured through like holistic remedies, sleep, stress, sunlight, being around good people, nutrition.

[00:23:08] You know, there's a lot of different variables to the yeah, the pillars of health.

[00:23:12] Right.

[00:23:13] And you speak about gut health.

[00:23:15] I do want to touch on that, too, because gut health is a very important topic because a lot of people are coming in struggling with gut related issues.

[00:23:22] So if we say IBS or irritable bowel syndrome, you can have diarrhea, constipation, alternating.

[00:23:29] You can have bloating.

[00:23:32] And I think that the that's where the one size fits all type of motto doesn't work.

[00:23:39] Right.

[00:23:39] Yeah.

[00:23:39] So that's where we're saying that, you know, it has to be individualized.

[00:23:43] It has to be customized.

[00:23:44] I tend to for several patients that do struggle with that use a more lower FODMAP type of diet, at least temporarily.

[00:23:51] I know some people are against that.

[00:23:53] Yeah.

[00:23:54] Because, you know, and for those that don't know, we're talking about oligosaccharides, disaccharides, monosaccharides, and polyphenols, which are more the fermentable carbohydrates that tend to feed the bad bacteria in our gut if those are present and cause those symptoms.

[00:24:10] And so I think I have seen that it is incredibly effective for a segment of my gut GI population implemented in a short-term basis.

[00:24:23] Obviously, it's very difficult to sustain.

[00:24:24] And you mentioned the best diet is one that you can sustain.

[00:24:28] But that's where I think there's a bit of friction between the overarching principles we talked about and a diet as specific as this.

[00:24:36] Yes.

[00:24:36] And it's so interesting because I agree.

[00:24:38] I think short-term, it can bring so many relief, so much relief to people who have IBS or IBD or Crohn's colitis, you know, any of the itises.

[00:24:47] It's all gut-related.

[00:24:48] So putting someone on a low FODMAP, I think, can help them bring so much relief and actually help calm everything down.

[00:24:56] I do think it's challenging to put, like, a college kid on a low FODMAP diet just because the accessibility to, like, they're not going to really do that.

[00:25:04] I mean, if you're in bad shape, you have no choice and you probably have to.

[00:25:06] It's hard enough with an adult.

[00:25:07] Right?

[00:25:08] Like, it's just hard.

[00:25:09] But it helps.

[00:25:10] So the more you can actually get them to eat less of these things, the more of the lower FODMAP plan, they'll just feel better so they're more in tune to sticking with it.

[00:25:18] But another good strategy is, like, and this is, again, a whole other controversial issue with nutrition is, like, the whole carnivoresque, you know, space.

[00:25:26] That can help heal a lot of itises, so, like, colitis.

[00:25:30] Autoimmune conditions.

[00:25:31] Autoimmune, all of that.

[00:25:33] And then you get the backlash of red meat's bad, and that's a whole other conversation.

[00:25:37] But grass-fed, grass-finished, wild-caught, organic pasture-raised, this is where these labels are so important.

[00:25:43] And the power of protein, right?

[00:25:44] There's a lot of proteins in these animal products that actually bring down inflammation on our gut health and bring down our A1C and our CRP levels and triglycerides and all of these things that are way too high in making us sick.

[00:25:57] So it can be really confusing.

[00:25:59] But those two things, I think, really can help the gut health symptoms and the whole bloating thing.

[00:26:05] Like, I hear that daily, and people think it's normal.

[00:26:07] But it's actually not normal to be bloated.

[00:26:09] And I once did, of course.

[00:26:11] But once you start to, you know, plug and play the certain foods, you find that chicken probably doesn't make you bloated.

[00:26:18] Like, you know, some wild salmon probably doesn't make you bloated.

[00:26:21] And you just, yeah, you can figure it out.

[00:26:24] Yeah.

[00:26:24] Yeah.

[00:26:25] So I think it's important for people to understand and get a little outside of these wars between the different diets, right?

[00:26:31] Because people pick a side, and they're, like, so tribal about it, you know?

[00:26:35] And we have to get out of that where we can, both things can be right, where this isn't a great long-term diet.

[00:26:41] But at the same time, it could benefit X person for a couple of weeks.

[00:26:45] And I've seen some dramatic results with the lower FODMAP diet.

[00:26:48] Oh, yeah.

[00:26:48] It's drastic how much it can help.

[00:26:51] And again, like, it might really help you.

[00:26:53] And then this person might do it and be like, okay, that didn't help me at all.

[00:26:56] You know, which, and that's the other thing about what's healthy and what's not.

[00:26:59] Like, sweet potatoes are a healthy food.

[00:27:01] But if I'm super allergic to sweet potatoes, it's not a good food for me.

[00:27:04] So, like, it's also just asking the question.

[00:27:06] It sounds so simple.

[00:27:08] But, like, after you eat, how do you feel?

[00:27:10] Like, if I feel awful after a bunch of salad with a bunch of raw veggies and no protein, which I do, not healthy for me.

[00:27:17] But if I feel really good with some, you know, organic rotisserie chicken and some cooked, like, broccoli and half an avocado, like, boom, that's a healthy food for me.

[00:27:26] Yeah.

[00:27:26] So even sometimes eliminating certain foods and figuring out your tolerance to them, gluten, dairy, all those, is definitely a really good approach.

[00:27:35] Yeah.

[00:27:35] Great strategy.

[00:27:36] Just always recommend doing, honestly, like a three-day food journal.

[00:27:39] It's amazing.

[00:27:40] You don't have to, or, like, get one of those free apps and just start plugging in your food to track your protein.

[00:27:44] You don't have to do it forever.

[00:27:45] But it's super eye-opening to understand, like, oh, shoot, I'm super low in protein.

[00:27:50] Let me up this.

[00:27:51] And then people start to eat more of this, less of this, boom, more energy.

[00:27:55] And now they're functioning at a higher level.

[00:27:58] Yeah.

[00:27:58] So I think it's important for people to realize that, you know, when we're talking about good gut health, we want, in general, to be, for people to be feeding themselves with the prebiotics and with foods that are, have those good fibers in them.

[00:28:13] Right?

[00:28:14] We talk about the produce section and kind of looking there and getting a variety of different colors to be able to then nourish the microbiome.

[00:28:23] Right?

[00:28:23] Because microbiome is a whole discussion on its own.

[00:28:26] And if we can really improve gut health, and this is the point I try to harp with as looking at things holistically, because PCOS is connected with gut health.

[00:28:37] And so many other things are connected with gut health.

[00:28:39] And you don't really see that out in the medical world, at least in the conventional medical space, where the specialists are connecting those areas together.

[00:28:50] So that's what we're trying to do with patients.

[00:28:51] And we're trying to tell them that we want a healthy gut so that your other issues around can be better.

[00:28:58] Totally.

[00:28:58] Whether it's your immune system, whether it's, you know, your brain and that function, very important.

[00:29:04] So, yeah, those are, I think, good principles for overall gut health.

[00:29:08] Yeah.

[00:29:08] And, yeah, I agree.

[00:29:10] And focusing on the majors of these things, right?

[00:29:12] Like, so many times it's like, what do you think about, you know, this probiotic brand versus this probiotic?

[00:29:18] I'm like, just get the probiotic.

[00:29:19] Like, of course, there's certain strains that help certain things.

[00:29:22] Or like, what do you think about this supplement?

[00:29:23] I'm like, well, you can eat it in this food.

[00:29:25] Like, always focus on the majors, which are the food.

[00:29:28] The foundational things.

[00:29:29] And then the minors come in with like these other little like superfoods or supplement here and there.

[00:29:34] And, yes, there's some core supplements that we should probably be taking every single day.

[00:29:37] But focusing on the majors and all the things I think that we've talked about to improve your gut health, which then in turn improves everything else.

[00:29:44] Because that whole functional medicine is the root cause of why do I have the headache?

[00:29:49] I'm not going to take the Advil to put the Band-Aid on it.

[00:29:51] I'm going to figure out why I have the headache.

[00:29:53] And that's probably through some imbalance in my body somewhere.

[00:29:55] Yeah.

[00:29:56] I did want to ask you about your thoughts on a ketogenic diet.

[00:29:59] Yeah.

[00:30:00] Because, you know, the ketogenic diet has been studied well for...obviously, it's a very difficult diet to sustain.

[00:30:05] Yeah.

[00:30:05] But at the same time, I think that for certain brain health issues and I think for a kind of quicker insulin resistance weight loss perspective, I think that that is, at least for a short term, something that I would consider a potential approach.

[00:30:25] So I'm curious about your thoughts on that.

[00:30:26] Yeah, I agree. And I think it can also be confusing, but I think if done right, so like done with, you know, your holistic doctor or someone you're seeing or, you know, a professional that knows how to actually get you in ketosis and what that looks like, it is a super helpful strategy.

[00:30:43] Yeah.

[00:30:44] I'm definitely more in the camp of like, okay, let me find the overall like most sustainable thing.

[00:30:48] Like, and it's probably not going to be that diet, but it can be close to it for sure.

[00:30:54] Right. And that's everything we've talked about.

[00:30:55] Yeah.

[00:30:56] But you can overshoot and then have those crashes.

[00:30:59] Correct. Or they can go like, they can do it.

[00:31:02] Right. Like super strict for two, three months, see crazy results.

[00:31:05] But then what happens when they start to try and figure out like a balanced life?

[00:31:08] They gain some weight back.

[00:31:09] They haven't really understood like what these macros do.

[00:31:12] So we don't have like too much of a balanced approach.

[00:31:14] But I do think it is can be super helpful for those insulin levels and glucose, depending on the person.

[00:31:20] Again, it's so individualized.

[00:31:22] Yeah. Yeah, definitely.

[00:31:23] I also want to touch a little bit on the lipid stuff that we were talking about earlier, because we were talking about nutritional research and how that has led to misinformation on that has led to these guidelines that are completely incorrect.

[00:31:41] And I think the biggest one is around what we've gotten wrong for decades, which is about fats and lipids, right, which is that they have been demonized for 40 to 50 years.

[00:31:51] And the recommendations then with the food pyramid by the government have been on carbs.

[00:31:56] So backwards.

[00:31:56] Yeah.

[00:31:57] And God knows how many people have suffered as a result and how much heart disease and things we have because of those recommendations.

[00:32:03] And they have now been corrected somewhat in recent years with the easing of those restrictions on fats.

[00:32:13] But I think people, it's important for them to understand that, you know, someone like Ansel Keys, who was a researcher in the 1950s, who basically took this research and essentially demonized saturated fats for saying that they raised LDL levels.

[00:32:33] And while that's true that saturated fats do raise LDL levels, they also will raise HDL levels, which is, you know, considered to be your, quote, unquote, good cholesterol.

[00:32:45] But they will raise HDL levels.

[00:32:47] And they will also make, what people don't realize is they will make that lipid particle or the LDL particle a little bit more bigger and fluffier, which is something that is a protective aspect.

[00:33:00] So definitely the saturated fats connection with heart disease has been misspelled to a good degree.

[00:33:09] And I think the other thing that people don't understand is they see that total cholesterol in their blood and then they just panic and freak out.

[00:33:16] And then they take away some of that.

[00:33:19] And so, or they want to get on a cholesterol medication.

[00:33:22] And that's something that I have with nearly every patient is a struggle to tell them, like, hey, that number is not actually a great marker for cardiovascular risk.

[00:33:33] There are other markers like ipolipoprotein B, lipoprotein the little A.

[00:33:40] Oh my gosh, which is never tested.

[00:33:42] Like, it is so hard to get that tested.

[00:33:43] And that's a huge tell.

[00:33:47] But yeah, like, I agree.

[00:33:48] And I think Etia says it as well in his book that I read.

[00:33:52] Like, what's killing us in America are inflammatory diseases.

[00:33:56] It's actually not having much to do with cholesterol levels.

[00:33:59] It's more inflammatory markers.

[00:34:00] Yes.

[00:34:01] So, the A1C, the CRP, the triglycerides, the fasting glucose, like those four things.

[00:34:06] If those are low and my cholesterol is slightly high, I'm probably for myself, which that's happening, right?

[00:34:13] Because I eat a lot of good quality meats and all the, you know, egg yolks and all the things that people get really scared of.

[00:34:20] Like, my inflammation is super low because I'm not out there, like, having a diet, a standard American diet or processed food diet.

[00:34:26] And I've never felt better.

[00:34:27] But if somebody looked at that and was like, oh my gosh, her cholesterol is pretty high, they would be really confused.

[00:34:32] So, like you said, trying to, you know, educate people on that in a small amount of time and not see them all the time or, like, not, you know, bombard them with all this research and overwhelm them is really challenging.

[00:34:46] But trying to just get more on that approach of, like, hey, look at your inflammatory markers.

[00:34:50] And they're like, oh, egg yolks are bad for me because of the cholesterol.

[00:34:53] And I'm like, no, that's where the choline is.

[00:34:55] That's where the amino acids are.

[00:34:56] Like, it's a complete protein.

[00:34:57] Like, we need these things to feed your brain.

[00:34:59] And just, yeah, the whole fat debacle of, like.

[00:35:02] Yeah, eggs have definitely been vindicated, which is nice because I eat two eggs every morning.

[00:35:06] Yeah.

[00:35:07] It's like, but yes, if you have too many eggs and you don't feel great, then scale back a little bit.

[00:35:11] But you're not going to, you know, eggs is not what's hurting us.

[00:35:14] Right.

[00:35:15] Yeah.

[00:35:16] And this is, I think, the point that I try to drive home to patients is that when you're talking about cardiovascular disease, you're talking about a process that's very, very complex.

[00:35:25] Not just high lipids equals higher risk.

[00:35:28] And we lower the, because there's a lot of people that are walking in or rather going into the hospitals with heart attacks and other cardiovascular issues.

[00:35:37] And they have absolutely normal or good lipid levels.

[00:35:41] So it tells you that the process is much more nuanced.

[00:35:43] Totally.

[00:35:43] And there's actually, we know that there's like something like 45 plus reactions that have to go through with that lipid particle before it gets oxidized and becomes atherogenic, let's say.

[00:35:55] Yeah.

[00:35:55] So to form plaque.

[00:35:57] So I think that that is a big kind of takeaway.

[00:36:01] And not to mention cholesterol is the building block of your hormones.

[00:36:05] Exactly.

[00:36:05] Like we need it.

[00:36:06] All of your estrogen, progesterone, testosterone comes from that.

[00:36:09] And so, yeah, that's one of my pet peeves.

[00:36:13] Yeah, it's a pain point for sure.

[00:36:14] Because honestly, too, like the older we get in life, obviously we drop some bone density.

[00:36:18] And then women, especially going through the peri-postmenopause stuff, their hormones are all out of whack.

[00:36:22] But a lot of it can be not completely helped or completely fixed through nutrition, but like a big chunk of it to just feeling better with the whole cholesterol thing, too.

[00:36:32] Like you actually need that stuff because it's the building block of all of these things.

[00:36:35] Yeah.

[00:36:37] So as we get closer to closing, I wanted to ask you just what are some of the takeaways that you wanted people to leave with?

[00:36:44] Yeah.

[00:36:45] Because obviously nutrition is such a big topic and I'm not, you know, planning to get down to the root of all of those nuances.

[00:36:53] But this is just meant to be a general discussion for people to get motivated to look into these areas, to become more informed about the areas that they are misinformed about.

[00:37:02] Yeah.

[00:37:03] So for the average person out there that's struggling with understanding nutrition or struggling to find the best nutrition for themselves, what are some of the main takeaways?

[00:37:14] Yeah.

[00:37:14] Oh, my gosh.

[00:37:14] It's so hard to like summarize into two or three things.

[00:37:17] But I will say like the reason I got into this space was because it can be so simple.

[00:37:23] So just keeping it super simple and then honestly, the consistency, I think this was a huge one for myself, too.

[00:37:30] Like the consistency and the direction that you go in is going to be way more powerful than the intensity and the speed that you go at, which is don't crash diet.

[00:37:40] Like change one thing.

[00:37:41] Right.

[00:37:41] Do that for two weeks and then change another thing.

[00:37:44] And then do that for two more weeks and then change another thing.

[00:37:47] And then you will start to build, right, these like bricks, brick by brick.

[00:37:51] Yeah.

[00:37:51] You will start to build these more sustainable now lifestyle things.

[00:37:55] And there's a lot of different things you can do.

[00:37:56] You can play with a little intermittent fasting.

[00:37:58] You can change your breakfast.

[00:37:59] You can cut down on added sugar.

[00:38:01] You can walk 10,000 steps.

[00:38:02] You can try and get to bed by 10.

[00:38:04] Like literally pick one of those five.

[00:38:06] And it's amazing like how much healthier you feel and how much better you feel.

[00:38:11] But it's really hard to tell a client, hey, you have to be in the gym and you have to go exercise when they feel awful because they're so tired because they're malnourished.

[00:38:18] So starting with nutrition, just being super consistent with one thing, whatever it is, and then just building from there.

[00:38:26] But also don't go so strict on one side or the other.

[00:38:30] Like I wouldn't go full vegan, but maybe not full carnivore.

[00:38:33] Like you got to be somewhere in between.

[00:38:35] And I think the third thing would be ask yourself.

[00:38:38] It sounds so dumb, but like ask yourself how you feel after you eat, regardless if someone's telling you to eat this or not.

[00:38:44] Like it doesn't matter what they're telling you to do.

[00:38:46] Intuition of your own body.

[00:38:47] Yes.

[00:38:47] Like if I eat X for breakfast and I feel like I want to take a nap, I'm not going to do that tomorrow.

[00:38:53] Like so just really asking yourself, do I feel bloated after this meal?

[00:38:56] Do I feel awful after I drink that night?

[00:38:59] Like how was my sleep?

[00:39:00] Did I eat too close before bed?

[00:39:01] Like kind of tap into the two.

[00:39:04] And it's just like a self, it's just an evolving like thing, right?

[00:39:09] Like go to the grocery store, start reading ingredient labels, try and get less sugar, less seed oils.

[00:39:14] Like there's so many places to start, but not feel overwhelmed because it can be so simple.

[00:39:19] Eat one ingredient foods.

[00:39:20] Yeah.

[00:39:21] I think it's maybe the biggest takeaway.

[00:39:23] Think about that.

[00:39:24] Yeah.

[00:39:24] Absolutely.

[00:39:24] I think just sticking, just firstly understanding that this is in improving your health, this is foundational.

[00:39:30] So this isn't a matter of what can you do for three months or six months.

[00:39:34] This is just like how you can change and go forward.

[00:39:37] And I think that there's so many aspects of diet and lifestyle as a whole that we need to improve on.

[00:39:42] Yeah.

[00:39:43] Where we've, the place that we've gotten to.

[00:39:45] Yeah.

[00:39:45] So these are some of the important principles.

[00:39:48] And with that, I thank you.

[00:39:49] Thank you.

[00:39:50] This is a really great discussion.

[00:39:51] Yeah.

[00:39:51] And I hope that people get benefit out of this and they can improve their nutritional journeys as a result.

[00:39:57] To feel strong.

[00:39:58] Yep.

[00:39:58] The power of nutrition.

[00:39:59] Thank you guys.